False Prophet Ronald Weinland

Yesterday, False Prophet Ronald Weinland spoke from Minneapolis.  As usual, people came from far and wide to see their spiritual idol.  Ron claims more are being baptized.

This was yet another sermon devoid of false prophecy (all his sermons are devoid of true prophecy).  He did have one aside that was interesting.  Quoting from his sermon beginning at 1 hour and 3 minutes into the version with announcements, Ron is referring to the song “But As For Me, I’ll Call on God“, page 45 in the WCG purple hymnal:

I think about one song that comes to me often, especially within the church.  ‘We walked to God’s house by-side in counsel blended sweet, we did as equals meet.’ It wasn’t a matter of looking down upon others.  There was that friendship there, that camaraderie.

As time has gone on, fewer and fewer are regarded by Ron as his equals.  Starting when he was ordained in 1981 and later rose to pastor rank, experiencing trials getting along with his congregation in Erie.  After a holding period in UCG, he broke away his own congregation and as related on this blog threw off the yoke of the lay church board.  And now he has no equals even among all the other Herblets with their own CoGlets since he is one of the Two Witnesses.  And he has no equal there, since he is the Spokesman of the Two Witnesses.

And then it goes on to tell about betrayal.  And I think about the things that have happened in the church.  Because when people leave God, and they go away from God, betrayal always follows.  Ugliness follows.   That’s why on the web sites out there you’ll find such garbage written toward me, that started toward Mr Armstrong.  And all the filthiness, all the lies, all the garbage that’s written out there…

Ron, Ron, Ron.  I’ve emailed you and asked you to write back and tell me anything I’ve posted that’s incorrect so I can fix it.  Since I haven’t heard anything from you then it must be true.  Starting with the $381,000 price for your mansion on the golf course, and continuing on with everything else.

The people who write so much of that stuff, you know who they are?  They’re people who used to walk to God’s house side-by-side in counsel blended sweet because they used to believe the same thing.  And now they’re filled with bitterness, they’re eaten up inside.

Ron, Ron, Ron.  Who are you talking about?  Dill Weed was never a CoGger, having a  JW background.  And neither was Jack.  And as I’ve explained previously, while you and I might have incidentally walked side-by-side to the big top through the piney woods 39 years ago, it wasn’t in “counsel blended sweet”.   Because while you were drinking HWA’s Flavor Aid by the gallon, I wanted out of there.  The only other poster still actively discussing you is Thielogical Bob, who doesn’t show any more or less of his misplaced arrogance than normal.  And by the way, Herbie is Bob’s spiritual idol too.

Some didn’t understand some of the things I was talking about awhile back when I talked about people being eaten up from the inside out.  In some cases those things happen physically as well.They destroy themselves more and more.  The more they tear apart God and God’s way of life and those who are Gods.

When I was transcribing this, I debated with myself as to whether an apostrophe belongs in the last word.  After considering Ron’s arrogance stating that everything he has is God’s his and teachings such as the sealing of the 144,000,  I decided that the transcription is accurate as I have it to indicate what Ron meant.

So here we get to the good stuff, Ron spiritualizes away his death curse, yet still implying that it has happened physically.  In what cases, Ron?  To whom, Ron?  Ron, we did understand your death curse.  We also understand that your prophecies are physical at the time of declaration.  Later on when they don’t happen, then they become spiritual.

They don’t understand what they do to themselves.  They’re miserably unhappy people.  Just like the demonic world, they’re miserable.  They live in misery.  They like to take their misery out on human beings because they hate human beings.  They truly do.  They like to see human beings suffer.

Now Jack has weighed in on his state of mind and it’s the opposite of what you state.  Dill Weed doesn’t seem miserable either.  And I’m rather happy, because indications are that you’ve lost a tithe slave.  Roger from Australia was about to join your group but decided to check into things and looked at my web site.  Perhaps he looked at my page showing all the failed prophecies in “2008 God’s Final Witness” started by Kirrily, yet another ex-tithe-slave.  I hope even more will do the same.  As I continue to mock Ron with every post I write, now 32 weeks after he issued his physical death curse against me.

In the past I’ve blogged about James Malm who had a prophetic timeline structured around the same 1335-day interval between Trumpets 2008 and Pentecost 2012 that Weinland is using for his current timeline.  Yesterday, James and Thielogical Bob have had a contretemps going as described on Bob’s blog and and on James’ website.

Malm states on his site:

We therefore expect a religious leader in Europe, to be empowered around 19 Oct 2009 and to call for a new order in Europe.  We would expect that he will do this in the name of PEACE, to provide peacekeepers to enforce the new peace agreement and to maintain world peace by providing a counterbalance to America and the Asiatic powers of Russia and China. This religious leader will become known as a man of peace, a real prince of peace. This new Roman Empire will be made up of ten independent nations with their foreign and military affairs controlled by a single leader.  By whatever title he is called, he will be an emperor.

During the exchange he had with Bob Thiel, James said to Bob:

I am having some impact and soon this will increase as these things come to pass.  I am simply offering you the opportunity to be aware of what is happening.

Also on the same web page, he said about Bob:

I am witnessing the truth to him, so that at the appropriate time, when he is humbled he will respond.

Both of these statements resound with me as being similar to statements Weinland has made in the past.  During the years leading up to the first timeline, Ron kept talking about disasters that would soon occur to give him credibility.  At the end of January, he called a two-day fast so his members could humble themselves before God and beseech him to bring about the thunders to humble the US.

At least James doesn’t have a following like Ron, and hasn’t asked them to cash in their life savings to send to him.  And back in October James promptly admitted his previous timeline was false.  There was a true statement about the future in association with that event:” Yet somehow I think that we will hear more from Malm in the future.”  (I’m the one who made it )

James would like to battle it out with Bob over interpretation of scripture, but Bob is dodging that discussion  — seems James would be better off following Bob’s own spritual idols Rod Meredith and Herbert Armstrong.  I’m not going to enter the scriptural fray either.  Too many false prophets have made much of it being so many days between a particular pair of dates — how many of them have been correct?  James’ prophecy seems to revolve around years with a 46-day interval between Pentecost and the 6th day of Unleavened Bread, which is not exactly a rare event.

It’s better to assume that a prophet is false unless and until he proves himself true.

I’ll let James have the last word on this post (that is until someone adds a comment )

Mike
Of course I believe what I say, or I wouldn’t say it. I do not make such an effort to say things I do not myself believe.  I am not so deceitful as that.  I do not represent predictions as Holy Writ nor do I claim infallability, nor do I make personal predictions in; the name of the Lord.

If Robert thinks I am a false prophet, then he MUST also admit that Herbert was one; for Herbert declared in the name of the Lord and I do not.

As far as witnessing the truth to him, I was referring to what I said in the correspondence.  This was about Idolatry and self righteousness and was not meant to be about any predictions.

The things I have said directly concerning doctrine and prophetic explanation are solid until proven otherwise.  The only thing in possible doubt for me is timing.  If these things do not happen this year, they will happen in some other year.  The scriptures will be fulfilled. As I said, I do believe what I say until I am proven wrong by events.  I do leave that door open and will acknowledge any error as it is proven.

I realize that I am not perfect and do not possess all knowledge, this is why I never declare any prediction; in the name of the Lord.   Deu 18 refers to speaking:” in the name of the Lord” and being presumptuous by declaring that our own thoughts are God’s Word.  I do not do that.  I make a clear difference between my own positions and what is Holy Scripture.

To be very clear.  At the appointed time, the false prophet will be set up.  He will call for a new order in Europe.  He will succeed within 75 days. A declaration of peace and security (safety) will come toward the end of those 75 days.  Sometime toward the end of those 75 days this false prophet will go to the Holy Mount.  A war will commence resulting in the occupation of Jerusalem and the defeat of Israel and her allies (America is obviously allied with Israel and will not let them go done. The argument about BI is irrelevant.) .  This is all Holy Scripture. It will all happen.  I stand on that because scripture declares it.

When this will happen is open to question.  To me it looks very strongly like it will happen this Autumn.  I am not prepared to state that it will definately happen this autumn.  However if it does not; it WILL DEFINITLY HAPPEN  some other year.

I make no claims for myself.  If you and Robert feel that I am a prophet, albeit a false one; that is your opinion.  I do not consider myself a prophet, either true or false.  I am just a person trying to wake up the brethren and get them thinking and questioning what they have been told. In an attempt to help turn some away from man worship and back toward God.

If I am wrong in thinking that this is the year, it will only prove my point.  Don’t rely on men, put God first. Only He knows all things.

Sincerely  James Malm

False Prophet Ronald Weinland has his multi-part sermons.  And this blog now has its multi-part discussion posts, this being the second part.

Part 1 of this series was a lively discussion.  It gave us a chance to use and review the meanings of several words and terms such as:

• regret
• repent
• sycophant
• Hermeneutics
• confirmation bias
• “Great.  Now I have guilt!!“  (for someone whose childhood literature/culture was of the “Goldilocks and the Three Bears” genre)
• Weinland’s views on Internet activity
• stay silently (lurk)

I think this discussion series has given us a chance to interact and maybe learn a little bit about each other.  We’re all still human even though we have diametrically opposite viewpoints on certain issues.  Hopefully the debate will be vigorous yet respectful and also informative.

Comment away!!

False Prophet Ronald Weinland was in San Jose today.  The attendance there was enhanced by people who traveled long distances to be there, as had a couple of the San Jose area who’d traveled to Los Angeles several weeks earlier.  Never pass up a chance to see the End-Time Witnesses doing their jobs live and in person.  Despite the extra attendance, Ron had to give his own closing prayer.

Since this was another sermon devoid of prophecy, we’ll discuss Ronald’s appearance at ideaCity a month ago.  He started his presentation with a warning:

Some of the things I have to say are extremely controversial and I in no means want to offend anyone. But the things I have to say sometimes are taken that way.  And the message I have is not a pleasant one.  It is toward the end if you understand, but it isn’t toward the beginning.

And I do have great passion about what I’m going to be speaking about, indeed.  And I hope that you will take away from this meeting things that you hear today because I don’t expect you to believe what you’re going to be hearing at this point in time.  But there are things going to take place very shortly now where when they begin to take place, I hope that these things will come back into your mind, the things that you hear here today.

As I was going through the biographies of those who are going to be presenters here,  One of the things that struck me quickly was in the bio for myself, where it said that I am an “armageddon forecaster”  A forecaster is one who predicts events for the future. [Ron blathers about Daniel]

There hasn’t been a prophet come to the world for nearly 2000 years now.  But I am just that.  I don’t expect you to believe it, but I am an end-time prophet. And sent with a very strong message, one that I would even ask that at the end of this that you not applaud.  Because it’s not a thing to applaud, what I’m going to be telling you.

[Ron spends several minutes babbling about the Hubble telescopes, billions of light years, etc]

We are now in a period of time at the end of 6000 years, that God has given to mankind to rule himself. [Spends several minutes discussing empires, governments, etc]

God has an incredible plan for mankind and we are now at that time where he is going to reveal more of it to us.  We have already started a period of time called the great tribulation, or a time of tribulation on the earth.  It’s already begun, especially in the United States, and people don’t see it yet.  It’s a time referred to in both the old and the new testament as “time, times, and half a time”, 1260 days, 3 and ½ years.  And it’s marked by some horrific things that are going to take place.  Because billions are going to die.  It’s not a pleasant thing to think about.  It’s not a pleasant thing to think that could even happen.  But God is going to reveal and show to mankind once and for all that we cannot govern ourselves.

[Expounds on technology]  God gave technology….. billions are going to die

We are at a time,  the end time.  The next great thing to happen is going to take place is in port cities, in some port cities in the US there will be nukular weapons that go off. That will be the time for you to bring back into your memory and to your mind the things that you’re finding very hard to believe here today.  That’s called the 2nd trumpet, and the 7th seal has already been opened.  [I'm sure that explained things to everyone -- 2nd this and 7th that.]

The first trumpet is about a beginning demise in the United States and the economy of the United States.  [Ron should have read the book "2008 God's Final Witness" which states: "When we are told that a third of all plant life will be destroyed, that is exactly what it means."] And you in Canada, Australia, New Zealand, western Europe, most of the world frankly, in great ways are tied into the greenback, the dollar.  …. This is the end.  …. and if God didn’t intervene when it’s all said and done, we would destroy ourselves.  … And the stock market, one day it’s going to crash, finally.  … The United States is prophesied to be the first great nation to fall.  As I heard the song here today “Oh Canada”, I had to look down at the floor.  Because I know, I believe with all my being, I know what’s going to come to pass, and I know the outcome of Canada.  And it hurts.  It hurts.  [It's the economy, stupid.]

There’s coming a time very rapidly here, when we come up to a time that’s referred to as the 5th trumpet.   And Europe is prophesied for the 7th time to have a great revival, called the Holy Roman Empire.  The 6th was during the time of Mussolini and Hitler.   The seventh is quickly coming.   Same countries as a whole, same ones involved again: Germany.

[blathers about British Israelism] we’re brothers

Because God is going to use the same nation, Germany, who are the ancient Assyrians to do again what they did before.  There are going to be ten nations that are prophesied to arise out of Europe who are going to be given great power, once again, one last time, on the earth.  And they’re going to do it because they’re going to see the demise of the United States, a vacuum that takes place.  And they’re going to do it for different reasons than what Hitler did because they feel they have to do this in order to stop a great breakdown in all things taking place throughout Europe. So they’re prophesied to rise once again here, and do the things that they do and start WW III.

They do it again, because going back in time [blathers more about British Israelism, which was humorous to some.]

China and Russia and the far east, it says they have a year and a month and a day that they prepare to confront them.  And they begin to take their pieces in the world, in South America and Africa and other places.  … And they engage Europe.  And it says they’re going to destroy a third of all human life.

And that brings us up to the time of Armageddon a few months later down the road.   ….  And those nations instead of engaging in a nuclear war…   He intervenes on that last day, because they come together in an area called Megiddo, … a time called Armageddon, …. and he destroys all the armies that are there from Europe, all the armies from Asia, and so forth.  And also their governments and their countries. And finally the good news.  The one who is Messiah, the one who is called the Christ.  …. He takes control.  He is in charge of that great army that destroys all those that are come together in Megiddo.

Because Weinland had spent most of his 20 minutes blathering about billions of light years and British Israelism (listing the modern day nations of Israel more than once), he did not have time to explain the imposition of God’s kingdom and the wonderful world tomorrow.  Instead, he ended with “Time is Up”, leaving the good news as about yet more destruction.

This would be the largest live audience Weinland has spoken to at least since Feasts of Tabernacles during the glory days of WCG.  If you count people listening in via electronic connections, still larger (ideaCity also provided electronic connections, with video to boot.)  Unlike reports that Ron sits when speaking these days, he did stand but it was only 20 minutes.The audience was silent during his presentation, and despite his earlier request gave him polite applause despite what they were thinking, such as a twitterer who tweated:

ronald weinland at #ideacity09 is a nutjob. crazy buzzkill.

There might also have been some reaction the mike didn’t pick up.  According to an article on the site:

One man, who was convinced that sharks are the most misunderstood of all species, predicted that by 2048 our oceans will be lifeless. And then humans will begin to eat each other. But that was OK because another man proved that the Bible says the world will end on May 27, 2012. One wag actually cried out: “What time?”

One person whose time is not up is myself, still criticizing and mocking a false prophet 30 weeks after he cursed me with a speedy death.

Back on Don’t Drink the Flavor Aid, we’ve had some general off-topic discussions.  And I must admit to being guilty of participating.  I’d like to keep discussion on other posts on-topic, but don’t necessarily want to shut down continuing debates on certain topics such as deaths of 5 ministers, etc.

So that’s what this post is for — general discussions relating to Weinland.  Please continue to play nice, no ad hominem attacks etc.

Happy commenting.

WO posted the following on the other post:

DRMR, everything has to happen in less than 3 years. Examples of failure would include:
1. Fifth trumpet not sounding by the last six months. Then I’de know something was up.
2. Ron saying something would happen and that not happening.
3. Ron not getting killed when he’s suppposed to.
4. Russia and China not coming together to destroy mankind by last few months, 3 at that as this was stated in the book. It was stated that that there would be fighting between Europe and Russia annd China for a few months before last battle.
While I don’t believe this would happen , the above are a few things that would make Ron to be proven false.

[Thanks to DRMR for being the first to go with my new flow and replying here]