Archive for August, 2011

The Mark Vs Avolo Debate Thread

Wednesday, August 31st, 2011

Lately, I’ve been cleaning up messes between Mark and Avalo that spill from one post to another.  Rather than fight it, I’ve decided to redirect it.

So: Mark and Avalo — Have at it here.  I’m going to copy over the last set of comments I tried to block to get you started.  Anything goes, but on this thread only.  Ad hominem.  Whatever.  All I ask is that whoever kills the other cleans up the mess and buries the body.

Note: There have been so many comments on this thread that it has overflowed to another page:

Page 1 with the first 250 comments here:

Page 2 starting with the 251st comment below:

The Wicked One

Sunday, August 28th, 2011

False Prophet was in hot, hot Los Angeles this weekend.  His senior elder Jim Jamieson came all the way down from Idaho to give the closing prayer.

Ron was seated in front of the faithful as he continued his series of sermon series reviewing all the “truths” revealed by Herbert Armstrong and himself. The interesting statements came before he began his sermon.  He received a number of questions from members about last weekend’s sermon, in which he made statements which imply that the 5th trumpet does not need to sound in January, 5 months before Jesus doesn’t return.  God hasn’t revealed everything to his most formidable prophet.  Specifically, he won’t know what the 2nd trumpet is until after it happens.  Hmm.  Let’s review his latest book, “2008 — God’s Final Witness”:

Amidst all the horrifying events that will unfold from this point forward, until the end-time tribulation is over and Jesus Christ finally returns, God will tell the world what is happening and why there is such devastation. God will even tell these things in advance. How will He do this? He will do it through His endtime prophets—His two witnesses, but He will do it primarilythrough me, His end-time spokesman. [page 88]

The question about how God has revealed His truth to me is a fair one. The answer that I am who I say I am will be given by the events described in both books coming true exactly as I have described. This will be the proof that I am God’s end-time witness and spokesman.[page 111]

By the fall of 2008, the United States will have collapsed as a world power, or it will have begun its collapse and no longer exist as an independent nation within six months after that time.[page 244]

Ron hammered on one of his old themes, that the apostate Joseph Tkach Sr. was the “man of sin” and the “son of perdition” described in 2 Thessalonians 2: 3-4.  I’ve made a case that this is actually Ron Weinland himself.  But this all is so symbolic it could be anyone.  If Joe Sr. was the “man of sin”, then Ron Weinland is the wicked one described in 2 Thessalonians 2 beginning in verse 8:

8And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming:

9Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders,

10And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.

11And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:

Yet through the epic fail of Ron’s prophecies and the lack of any proof that he is what he claims even according to his own definitions, people continue to follow him and will continue to follow him even after Christ doesn’t return according to Ron’s current schedule next May, less than 39 weeks from now.


Tuesday, August 23rd, 2011

Recently long time commenter Mark became offended after I allowed Avalo to post his opinion and went over to Jack’s blog to post:

I have realized that what matters to me more is the weltanschauung of the blog owner. Turning people away from Weinland is a noble thing, but it just leaves a person in limbo. Attempting to bring that person to an authentic relationship with Jesus through scriptural proof is more important to me than just chronicling the lies, deception and audacity of a two-bit preacher.

To which Jack responded eloquently:

Mark, believe me when I tell you, a person who has just escaped Ron’s grasp and is in limbo, the last thing they want to hear is someone preaching the gospel. They have to go through a complex trial of emotions and an introspective nightmare that will last months. No matter how nice I, or anyone, may be to an ex-cult member, the last thing they will want to talk about is God. Anyone who talks about their former situation or any kind of religion will receive a tirade of profanity and insults that will make them wish they had not brought up the subject.

I guess you could ask Kirrily and the relations of PKG members with whom I have corresponded privately via email if they felt that I left them in limbo because I didn’t push a particular religious agenda on them. We’ll have to wait for them to weigh in.  That is if they choose.  Because I regard our private email  exchanges as exactly that — private.  For example, I’ve known for some time that Kirrily and her husband are expecting their first child.  While I wasn’t sure why Kirrily chose not to share her happy news on my blog, I felt it was up to her to choose whether and when to do so.  So again Kirrily, congratulations.  I’m glad that you and your husband are getting the child you’ve wanted for so long.

As a result of Mark’s comment, I learned something new.  The meaning of “weltanschauung” which is world view.  In the comment sections to my posts, I’ve allowed others to express their opinions, within limits.  Including a recent one by Mark himself which quoted some scripture and a religious point of view.  To which Avalo responded with a different point of view resulting in everyone ganging up on him as though how dare he express a different point of view.   I just have to wonder how secure you are in your thinking if someone else expressing a different opinion upsets you.

Do I have a “weltanschauung”?  Yes, I do?  What is it?  Well, while I haven’t expressed it, I’m not in the least ashamed of it.  Rather, I thought it might distract from the subject of this blog, which is not my particular weltanschauung but rather False Prophet Ronald Weinland and the effect his lying insanity is having on others.  I will express this much of my weltanschauung which is relevant:

Do your own thinking, don’t let someone else do it for you.

The Last Time

Sunday, August 21st, 2011

False Prophet Ronald Weinland was in Portland yesterday.  His local elder Chris Czech is still drinking Ron’s Flavor Aid and gave the opening prayer.

Yesterday afternoon at 12:36 in Cincinnati was a prophetically significant time.  It was exactly halfway through the 40-week period of judgment on the US.  At that time, we also entered “Jacob’s Troubles” and were precisely 40 weeks from when Christ is to appear in the skies over Jerusalem.  Jacob’s Troubles are another one of those biblical concepts open to interpretation and reinterpretation to suit.

Ron also stated that things don’t have to happen in January.  January is the 5-month point by which the scattered nations of Israel are to be conquered by the beast power.  Ron pointed out that the last three weeks of Jesus’ life is when he conducted the most significant part of his ministry.  So it’s clear that Ron will spiritualize the 5th trumpet at some point so he can drag his timeline out somewhat more.  Just as he’s spiritualized my speedy death resulting from his curse.

Tortured “Truths” in Toronto

Sunday, August 14th, 2011

False Prophet Ronald Weinland returned to the scene of the crime from two years ago, Toronto in which he prophesied “nukular” explosions before a skeptical audience at ideaCity.  But despite none such in the two years since, someone was brought into the fold, perhaps an ex-WCG who saw a rerun on Canadian TV.

Ron is still slowly working his way through his “Truths” and it still appears likely that he will be able to milk them all the way up to the feast in October.  It seems that we never can fully understand the truths that HWA made up.

Ron looks forward to next Saturday’s sermon, which will be 40 weeks from the non-return of Jesus Christ and halfway through the 40-week period of judgment on the United States which he declared a few months ago.  Perhaps he’ll also clarify when my speedy death which he declared in December of 2008 is going to happen.

Man at His Best

Thursday, August 11th, 2011

False Prophet Ronald Weinland has posted infrequently on his personal blog with posting intervals measured in months.  But now he’s posting even more than I have — another post just a few days after the last one and both since my normal weekly post.  He smells blood in the water with the current economic turmoil.  Here is his post and an opportunity to comment.

——————–  Weinland’s Latest “Prophecy” ——————————–

When is man at his best? To understand this question, is to first notice why fear and a bit of panic has entered the world market place over the past week. It is the beginning to understanding why God has revealed that mankind must suffer so very much over the next several months.

It is God’s purpose at this end-time that mankind must experience great fear and panic, as everything in which he trusts no longer gives support, intervention, or help of any kind. All the institutions and governments of mankind are nearing collapse. You are now beginning to witness the real emergence of what brings about that total collapse.

The Mortar Is Failing

We live in an age that seemingly appears far superior to all other ages of mankind. The last hundred years, with the explosive advancement of science and technology, has made the previous thousands of years of man on earth seem archaic and primitive by comparison.

Then, here at the end of this age of mankind, with his self-rule on earth, we see a basic structure that developed over the past fifty years that became the mortar for a “global” economy. We live in a period of earth’s history where the United States of America emerged to become the single greatest power the earth has ever known.

This power has been reflected in resources of wealth, technology, military strength, government influence, and monetary stability on the world scene. In the midst of this the dollar became the mortar that has held together a global economic system that is now beginning to crumble under a weight it can no longer sustain—no matter what action anyone or any government takes.

The cracks that began to emerge in 2008 are now crumbling and collapsing before our very eyes. We are rapidly moving toward markets that will crash, banking institutions that will end, and a failing dollar that will thrust the world into war, as the United States goes the way of all empires of the past.

But who dare say such things! We are told that many of the corporations and banking institutions in the U.S. are too large to fail (to allow them to fail). But they are still failing no matter how much money is printed and pumped into them. The world is now awakening to that ugly truth.

How dare a rating agency downgrade the U.S.? After that, a cry went out that declared how the U.S. has always been a triple “A” country and always will be.

After the initial cracking in the economy struck in 2008, it didn’t take long before pride and arrogance began to enter the market place once again. Much like the Titanic, the attitude has prevailed that the dollar, with the economic structure of the U.S., is too large to sink. Yet it is starting to sink!

At this present time in man’s history, the dollar and all the global markets intertwined with it have begun a final process of implosion with no ability whatsoever to save it from happening. As this rippling affect circles the world, the markets and banking systems of one country after the other spiralling downward, nations will react in the only manner they see as a last resort—war!

Bad, But Soon Much Worse

Stocks plunged dramatically last week and continued even more on Monday. But Tuesday, it surged upward in record proportion. A little hope for a little while!

Then today, everything that was so dramatically gained on Tuesday was lost in one fell swoop, and even more so, as the market plunged by nearly 520 points.

At the close of the markets, CNBC asked the question, “Do you know where your money is?” This was a take-off of the expression, “Do you know where your children are?”

Now, at this very moment, gold has passed the $1800 mark. Another headline today stated, “Investors Flock to Gold and U.S. Treasuries.” How sad that people still don’t “see” that the dollar is the problem—the old mortar that has dried up, cracking throughout, and now crumbling under the weight it can no longer sustain.

As markets and banks are in “freefall,” as another headline states, people still think there is “safety” in U.S. Treasuries, in which they trust. And those who trust in gold—it too will fail. It won’t be long before people will gladly give their gold for the simple commodity of food.

That in which people trust will continue to fail. Markets will fail. Banks will fail. The dollar will fail. Governments will fail. Even religions will fail.

“In God We Trust”

This is what is stated on the dollar. Yet that is not true. Instead, the world grew to trust in the dollar itself. As was stated at the beginning of this post: “It is God’s purpose at this end-time that mankind must experience great fear and panic, as everything in which he trusts no longer gives support, intervention, or help of any kind.”

It is this very process that will bring man to his best state, which is one of humility. It is pride that led people to believe the Titanic could not sink. It is pride that insists the dollar cannot fail. It is pride that declares the U.S. cannot become less than other countries around the world.

Only when some of mankind, beginning first with the U.S., is brought to true humility will some finally come to the only truth that can save them, when they finally cry out in genuine sincerity and humility, “In God we trust!”

———————  End of Weinland’s Latest Blather —————————-

Our Spokesman Witness doesn’t allow commenting on his blog.  But I do and here’s your opportunity.

Real Fear is Now On the Horizon

Monday, August 8th, 2011

A new post appeared yesterday on Ronnie’s personal blog.  As usual, I repost it for when he deletes it and to allow commenting.

————————————— Ronnie’s blathering ————–

This past week the word “fear” was used extensively in the news. There was investor fear, fear gripping Wall Street, debt fear among nations, fear about a struggling European economy, and even fear of war.

Real fear has not yet struck, but it is now on the horizon. Strong warnings are sounding out with increasing intensity. However, the basic nature of man and woman is to bury fear—to “bury ones head in the sand,” hoping that when they look out once again that things will be better. We have arrived at a time when things are not going to get better, but instead are going to spiral downward with accelerating intensity.

The world is starting to come to the realization, although rather slowly, that the United States cannot resolve its financial crisis. Other nations are beginning to see that the U.S. does not have the will or means to change. It is for this reason that governments will move more rapidly toward “other” means to protect their interests—by moving themselves farther away from reliance on American stability and prosperity. Both stability and prosperity are increasingly being seen as a thing of the past—an era in decline.

You are witnessing the final events that are rapidly plunging the world into real fear, as a complete global economic meltdown finally strikes. It is now accelerating. Nations are just beginning to become aware of that inevitable reality. It is for this very reason that world war will also quickly follow a global economic meltdown. War is the only “means” through which this world can deal with such crisis within their own nations. This is the real history of man and of war!


We’re Blessed to Have Air Conditioning During the Great Tribulation

Sunday, August 7th, 2011

False Prophet Ronald Weinland was in Florida this weekend. His elders Jeff Newell and Newt Carter gave the prayers. Since we haven’t heard from Bill Kotaska (one of the 2008 class of elders) for awhile, perhaps rumors of his departure from PKG are accurate. The feast site in Florida is under-prepared and over-subscribed, so people will have to host meetings to listen to Ron’s prerecorded sermons in their hotel rooms.

Last week’s difficulties with the audio were as I suspected, the technical incompetence of the Spokesman Witness.  Someone who has the power to stop it from raining and turn water into blood can’t read a technical manual.  Fortunately for him the young Yurii Zelenev knows how to do that.  Maybe Ron should ask Yurii to download the technical manual on Witness Powers and read it to him.

Ron thought about a sermon on our economic issues, but decided to hold off so he could do his normal prophesying while looking in the rear view mirror.  Instead, he continued his sermon series on the numbered truths.  He made it up to the 13th invented truth out of 57.  At this rate he may catch up by the feast except he’ll probably invent some new ones by then and still be behind.  Ron looks forward to when people will be freed from the bondage of false doctrine. Ron, you have the power to do that: free your deluded followers by admitting that you made it all up.

Ron mocked the Catholic church for telling its followers that the Bible is a mystery and they can’t understand it on their own.  Since PKG members haven’t taken their irony supplements, they remained in the chair for more of it.

According to my notes from October of 2009, Ron stated that the latest the 5th trumpet could blow was two weeks from today, on August 21.  The next couple of weeks will be quite busy as the first 4 trumpets blow followed by the 5th.  Look for jack-booted German soldiers marching down your street very soon.