Believe or Leave

False Prophet Ronald Weinland was in the Los Angeles this weekend. He announced that his associate elders Willy Doemeland and Tina Jamieson are recovering from their ailments. Ron did not return to Cincinnati from his gig in Portland last week because it was too arduous to travel across 3 time zones. At 61 years of age he’s no spring chicken. Ron imported his traveling senior elder Ralph Dowd and his senior evangelist Johnny to give the prayers. Perhaps the PKGers aren’t traveling as much as they used to as he mentioned only one other out-of-stater in attendance.

This was the wrap-up to his “More Time” sermon series. I guess he’s anxious to get back to his series on tithing. He reviewed the quarterly report and has disfellowshipped some who stopped tithing. How dare they rob Ron God? Also, it’s getting back to him that some are murmuring about him being a false prophet and he wants to get rid of them. He also made an indirect reference to Ananias.

Ron revisited some of his old themes, particular the one about his Red Sea moments — his metaphor for being in a hard place with no place to go, like the Israelites at the banks of the Red Seawith the Egyptian army in pursuit. Ron went through the story of Gideon’s army of 300 and his “running down the hill” distortion. One that I don’t recall him mentioning for some time is his prophecy from several years ago that his church will get 3000 more members from “the scattering”, which is those who were baptized members of WCG when Joe Tkach Sr. opened the first seal on December 17, 1994.

Ron is looking forward to gaining 3000 more members. The members have the Feast of Tabernacles to look forward to at which Ron will deliver 2 more “truths”, bringing the total up to 55. I’m looking forward to the IRS moving their investigation forward, and perhaps they are. Ron talked about a stirred-up demonic world, which recently has been references to the IRS investigation – the last time they were stirred up was when his daughter and church bookkeeper was served with an IRS summons.

46 Comments

  • So what you’re saying is that Wineland spent tithepayer dollars to fly/drive in two ministers just for the sake of giving the opening/closing prayers? Is he so draconian that he wont even trust a laymember with something so harmless as a 2 minute blessing on the service? He must be rolling in the dough for these kinds of useless expenditures. I suppose thats not much different than sending the G2 back to home-base to pick up your barber. Sigh.

  • Mike (DDTFA) says:

    Oh, I think it was more than just giving the prayers. Ron needs more people to fill up the small conference rooms he rents when traveling to remote areas. He has had other people travel with him as well. His daughter/bookkeeper Audra Little, and his on-staff technical geek Greg Chipps.

  • Do you have any estimate or has he mentioned in a sermon or something just how big his member base even is? It’s gotta be fairly small, I mean even the most ignorant, complacent, head-in-the-sand person like I used to be has GOT to see that he’s a total raving lunatic. I mean it’s just so damn obvious! Still, to bring even a small handful of staff around with him is such a throwback to the days of HWA. Hell, when I was in PCG even those ministers only brought their wives on congregational visits. Then again, Whineland doesnt have an empire to rebuild so he doesnt have to be as stingy with the $. Onward…

  • Mike (DDTFA) says:

    Ron has claimed that he had around 300 members in the years prior to 2008, when his membership had 300 % growth. My estimate is that he has around 700 members. If he gets $2000 per year from each member (on the average), that’s cha-ching!!! $1.4 million. Since he doesn’t own any buildings, that should leave plenty of money to pay for travel.

    More on Weinland’s finances in these posts.

  • I’m in the wrong line of work! But wait, I have morals that prevent me from living off of the lies I tell people. Rats!

  • Kirrily Xpkg says:

    Because I was Waynes spy, he used to ask me if a member had been working. I told him yes. They then knew he wasn’t tithing. I believe one of the reasons he was eventually disfellowshipped. I was a good little sheep-spy.

  • J says:

    If you felt any guilt about ratting out fellow members, at least take solace in that you rescued them from further emotional/financial slavery.

  • Rambo says:

    “He reviewed the quarterly report and has disfellowshipped some who stopped tithing. How dare they rob Ron God? Also, it’s getting back to him that some are murmuring about him being a false prophet and he wants to get rid of them”

    Anyone know where in the sermon he said this?

  • Mike (DDTFA) says:

    Start listening at 38 minutes in the sermon-with-announcements available on the PKG website. Next week after they trim the announcements, start listening at 30 minutes into the file.

  • Whisper says:

    He disfellowshiped some? Lucky stiffs! Freedom is but a disfellowshiping away!

    People might be grumbling about Ron being a False Prophet? Wonderfule news, just wonderful! Freedom is but a grumble and disfellowship away!

  • JB says:

    It warms my heart to hear about the disfellowships and grumbling. Would that be another thunder or a seal opening, I get confused!

  • Aggie says:

    “I know for a fact that she does not pay tithe since she has no “tithable” income. SS is exempt “

    Say what you will about the wacky world of the CoG splinters, that has to be the one and only positive change almost all of them, AFAIK, have made to the tithing doctrine.

    That, and paying tithes on your net income, not your gross income amount, the way we used to have to.

    I really have to wonder, how do the CoG leaders reconcile that change, though? After all, they are “departing” from “church doctrine”, by no longer requiring those things — so do they know it was a move of pure greed on Armstrong’s part, and that they won’t get away with it anymore, in a post-changes CoGdom that sees members splinter-hopping from one CoG to the next?

    And how do those still tithing, who remember the church before the changes, reconcile those changes? Besides the relief that they won’t be reduced to eating Kraft Dinner and Hebrew National Wieners during their 3rd tithe year, and/or tithing while they are on welfare/old age pension/etc., how can they possibly not get the cognitive dissonance in that??

  • Aggie says:

    Oh, and Rotten Ron was complaining about the murmurings and grumblers in July 2008, too…but people were still pissed off over “If by Pentecost (June 8, 2008),” at that point…..

  • Personally I find it ridiculous that SSI would be exempt considering the logic of these groups. Nobody has a problem expecting some poor family – with both parents working several minimum wage jobs just to put food on the able – to pay tithes. And they may only bring in the same amount as the grandma on SSI, but she’s exempt? Income is income is income. Seems like these doctrines are pretty flexible for these groups. Oh well, the entire tithing concept is ridiculous to me now. Wasnt the doctrine entirely penned by Herman “I swear I’m not Buddhist” Hoeh? The guy who was so obviously a sellout that he changed history numerous times just to fit the teachings of HWA and yet went along with the changes initiated by Tkach Sr.? Hoeh, the guy who used his tithe dollars however he saw fit “for the college”? The whole biblical principal of tithing was intended for the israelite people, in an agricultural sense and only while there was a priesthood to support (which is why the jews dont tithe today!) End rant.

  • Steve says:

    Interesting and yet more proof Ron is completely illogical and therefore his god is too (& therefore not a god)……because he makes comparisons of Gideon a warrior & his 300 warriors but yet Ron says fighting is evil & you can’t even use a bat for self defense (unless he has modified his teaching on his website index of doctrines since i last saw it) It is the same thing as using a comparison of his group being prostitutes and him the pimp…there is no difference as he alledgedly views both as being wrong/unjustified. He is full of holes like swiss cheese more and more everytime he types anythin down and anytime he opens his deceptive mouth.

  • Tom says:

    Comment removed for being off-topic, and not for that reason alone. Mike(DDTFA)

  • Tom says:

    Tom, the topic of this blog is False Prophet Ronald Weinland. This is a free country, so you’re free to believe all the anti-semitic crap you want. But you’re freedom doesn’t extend to this blog. If you want to blog about that, there are plenty of other places to do that, or in any case you can get your own blog for free. Mike (DDTFA)

  • Matt says:

    I was wondering when this blog would get its own pet white power / antisemite freak. Every blog and forum always seems to end up with at least one. Mike, can’t we keep him? I promise I’ll feed him every day and clean his box out once a week.

  • So was he another Armstrongite defending Anglo Israelism and or Whineman or just some random nutcase who saw your earlier blog with the picture of the right wing extremist in front of the swastica and was thus compelled to join the fray? His posts were yanked before I got to read them lol

  • jack635 says:

    the picture of the right wing extremist in front of the swastica

    I bet it was the flag. Just another example of the delusional seeing a “sign”.

  • Mike (DDTFA) says:

    Tom made his first comment on the other thread. I didn’t care for it, but Debbie had already responded so I left it up. Since the thread was meandering, I locked further commenting on that thread. So Tom posted more-of-the-same here on this thread.

    And Matt: No, you can’t keep him!! I’m always the one who has to clean up the messes. 😀

  • GD says:

    Ron does not care about God ,the Bible or mankind in anyway ,he is just a common theiving crook deceiving people for money

  • Whisper says:

    Anti-Sematism, judging by the picture for the last topic of this blog, is exactly what Ron is endorsing, although it probably went right past him that he was garnering factoids from Anti-Sematists. Ron looks like the type (I’ve seen his pointy head in pictures) to garner factoids supporting his crazy opinions from whereever he can find them regardless of the source. Honestly, take a good detailed look at Ron’s picture with the Misses on Mikes sidebar, I mean woof, would you follow this man? Does he look inspiring? When you think Apostle or Prophet of God does that picture come to mind? When you think of the most powerful man ever to be born of man and woman do you think of Rons paesty white bald skin and fearful nature and think “Oh ya, I can see the power of God in him”?
    One look at Rons picture trying to look regal in a leather chair with a nice suit and a world globe nearby told me the story and all I had to do to back up my poor opinions of Ron was watch him open his mouth and oh but the garbage just rolled right out of him.

    But what can ya’s expect from a nutcase who thinks of himself as a Witness of God? Nutball!

  • I’ve never had experience in Whineman’s group (for that I thank God) but I decided to use him in my banner art because that picture of him in the chair was just too good to pass up. It reminds me of “old wrinkly” AKA Emperor Palpatine from star wars, sitting on his throne, so calculating and sinister. And now immortalized in my blog banner which will probably stay up for a long time after PKG disintegrates into 15 new splinters lol

  • Matt says:

    Is there some link between COG-ism an UFO’s? Or do they believe that the entire governmental apparatus of the USA government is set up just to keep them down? If so, you could do a blog item about that with plenty of links and pictures. Those topics attract a lot more acceptable class of nutcase altogether, I find. Far less likely to chew the furniture when you are at work, and more easily housetrained.

  • jack635 says:

    Ron does not care about God ,the Bible or mankind in anyway ,he is just a common theiving crook deceiving people for money

    I’ll second that!

  • Mal says:

    Frankly, GD and jack635, anyone even remotely interested in Ron Weinland or still ‘on the fence’ would laugh you guys to scorn. If you want to make a legitimate case against him, I suggest you get real with your comments.

    To say he does not care about God or the Bible is disproved simply by listening to any single one of his multitude of sermons. He refers to the authority of God numerous times in every sermon, and consistently reads and refers to Bible passages.

    It is clear to me that the man completely and utterly believes in who he thinks he is and totally believes in his timelines.

    If you want to make a credible case against him, and one far more likely to convince Weinland followers that might look at this blog, I suggest you present evidence you have that the man is deluded.

  • Mal… (Latin for Bad…), the first 15 minutes I ever spent on this blog convinced me that Weinland does not care about his followers or God. If he did, would he make the bold claims he has? For him to make predictions like this, doesnt that imply that he feels he is getting his information from God? Either he knows he’s not really, or he really thinks he is in which case you have your proof of delusion in the very first prophecy that fails to come to fruition. Onward…

  • Mike (DDTFA) says:

    Mal, I would be careful against criticizing GD, who has been personally affected by Weinland’s false prophecies.

    Ron may talk a good line for you, but he doesn’t walk the walk. If he really cared about what God said, then he’d take Revelation 22:18-19 to heart.

    Evidence that Ron is deluded? Try all of his prophecies Vs reality. And I’m talking this timeline, the previous timeline, and all the prophecies leading up to the first timeline, for example the first phase of the fifth thunder.

    But maybe Ron isn’t deluded. If not, then he’s a con man. (Aggie will soon swoop in and insist that to be the only possibility). But I’ll consider two possibilities, the ones that Splintersurfer presented.

  • Oh I’ve totally got my money on option B: Con-man.

  • Atrocious says:

    Mal, just because [Ron] “He refers to the authority of God numerous times in every sermon, and consistently reads and refers to Bible passages.” doesn’t mean he believes what he is saying. Anybody can use the “authority of God” or “scriptures” in their speeches and claim to believe it, but actually be using that as a clever con. “By their fruits you shall know them” and Ron’s fruits are NOT of God. Plain and simple.

  • Mike (DDTFA) says:

    Surfer, what’s your opinion on whether That Other False Prophet (and you know who I mean) is a con-man?

  • Atrocious: Amen to that.

    Mike, thats a tough one. I would love to say yes, really I would, but when I think of “con-man” people like Weinland come to mind. Swiss bank accounts just loaded with money, lavish lifestyle, frequent world travel. When I look at “That Prophet” I see fraud for sure, in the sense that he knows he’s deceiving people, he knows the information is freely available on the web that can ruin him and he frequently takes great effort to hide this from the membership, but in terms of financial con-man, just look at the 15-20 Mil he’s spent building his auditorium. He could have put that money in a bank. No, he’s deluded himself into thinking that he really is a prophet, that he really is taking over the reins from HWA, and that he really is “raising the ruins”. He probably justifies his deceit and draconian tactics as necessary for “the good of the people”. That and he is a total Egomaniac.

    His goons however, are largely in it for the money and power. In his own mind, Gerry’s a full blown prophet of God.

  • Mike (DDTFA) says:

    I’m not fully in either camp when it comes to whether Weinland is a con-man or is deluded. Ron’s Total Resolve Cruise suggests con-man. OTOH, Ron has spent millions on promoting, printing, and shipping his books (claims to have sent out 1/2 million of them and I think that’s possible). In July of 2008, he found out that IRS Criminal Investigation had started investigating him. Instead of fleeing the country to live off his Swiss stash, he at least claimed in December of 2008 that he was closing the Swiss accounts and bringing the money back. Aggie thinks he’s running a “long con”, but personally I think the cons long past its expiration date. So I tend to think that Ron deludes himself after which he deludes his followers.

    Not sure what information is out there that could ruin Six-Pack Gerry. I think his followers are either aware of his arrest but in any case it wouldn’t matter — there’s always the David defense.

    For some reason, Ron has not mentioned the IRS criminal investigation in sermons. I suspect many of his members are aware of it anyway, at least that’s what Audra stated in her affidavit. I didn’t think that the IRS investigation would make a difference to his followers, but one of his members left PKG after reading about it on my website. I don’t understand why he hasn’t mentioned it in his sermons, applying a self-promoting spin on the situation to immunize his followers. Perhaps too many would wonder why he doesn’t just breathe fire on the IRS special agent and be done with it.

  • I might put more stock than you do into the gravity of his editing MOA. The sections he took out were not edited for spelling or grammar issues, nor was HWA’s observation in this particular instance wrong. Gerald had no legitimate reason to remove the section on prophets. How could he explain the removal to a curious member? Remember, they spent millions just to get that book, millions more just to emphasize how close they stick to HWA’s teachings by rebuilding his empire. HWA is the unofficial god of the PCG. For them to change any of his teachings in secret would just have to upset people if they knew. Why else does Gerry want them to stay off the internet lol.

  • Mike (DDTFA) says:

    Maybe I’ve been too jaded by the active self-deception exhibited by PKG members. Ron now claims to be both the Elijah-to-come and a witness, yet he has literature that says this is not possible.

    About a year ago, a member commented on my blog that Ron must not have been addressing his death-curse-to-mockers against me. Because after all, I’m still alive and Ron didn’t name me specifically. (But then he didn’t name anyone specifically).

  • Atrocious says:

    Has ANY of the mockers died recently?

  • I’ve had a nagging cough this week, it may just be a result of this curse. Is the curse retroactive? Will I be immune because I was not a mocker at the time of it’s pronouncement or does anyone who becomes a mocker immediately fall into the category of accursed? I dont want to slowly die of this cough so I kinda need to know…

    Or not :p

  • Matt says:

    Mal, are you saying that despite all his predictions, of which none came to pass, and all his outrageous claims, none if which bear out, that you can still find enough fence to sit on? Have you been drinking the Ohio water too? Does reality not matter at all?

  • Mike (DDTFA) says:

    Surfer, you’re under the curse along with anyone else who mocked Ron after he pronounced it. But don’t worry about dying slowly from your cough — you’re going to die speedily, just as I have sometime during the last 19 months. 😀

    Actually, NONE of Ron’s mockers have died since the curse. One of his elders died shortly after being ordained.

  • jack635 says:

    If you want to make a legitimate case against him, I suggest you get real with your comments.

    Mal, you were on the weinlandwitness. I’m sure you read all my posts. Every time I disproved Ronald Weinland with scripture, I was either taunted or the commentor simply stopped posting. What is the point of doing it all over again? You clearly support Ron. I use the new testament to disprove his credibility.

    Over on WW the “before Abraham was, I am” post I made was completely ignored by redirection to another topic, and I was told that “you are of your father the devil”. Those who follow Ronald Weinland refuse to look at the truth. Which is more credible? The new testament, or 2008 GFW?

    God’s Final Witness’ very pages are contradicted by the words that came out of Jesus Christ’s mouth, as recorded by his real Apostles.

    If Jesus cannot tell a lie because he is of the truth, why does Ronald Weinland tell his followers that Jesus lied when he said “before Abraham was, I am”?

    This is just one example of Ronald Weinland’s many mistakes.

  • Mike(DDTFA) says:

    Today’s Wikipedia article of the day is “confirmation bias“. Let us all take a moment and forward that to any PKG member we know. 😀

  • Steve says:

    Mal, if you have taken the time to “deeply think” and analyse Ron and his claims it is perfectly obvious that Rons God is capable of mistakes ( & thus not a God) or he would give him the truth straight away not “continuously” through revelation which in this case just means editing his previous mistakes and hey presto “God revealed i was almost on the right track but was off slightly, i meant green money not trees being burnt up…its symbolic now” blah blah. Secondly God is also not logical as i have constantly pointed out in even the simplest of terms….if even one error can be pointed out, it is not of any God for a God would be perfect or they are simply not God but capable of error/manipulation/outright lies etc etc

    I think the reason you are perhaps still on the fence is because of a factor that continues to Pi** me off about most religions…the fear factor….DO WHAT I SAY OR I’M SENDING YOU TO HELL God says…regardless of how hard it is to even freakin tell what the hell God is sayin we should do in the first place in books like the bible (workin out his will is ridiculously difficult hence the literal millions of different interpretations of all kinds of scriptures). FEAR is the key to control and so i believe this is what you need to think of as this is not the right reason and it is certainly not a fair and just way to live your life in fear of going to hell all the time or missin out on the first resurection (whatever reason it is) or just surviving the non existent apocalypse (which you wont anyway cuz Ron told me most of his followers will die a horrible death and they have no protection just because they are in his church) I could go on forever but i won’t as i doubt you will bother to listen to my words but i hope i’m wrong.

  • Steve says:

    Mal assess what you know your God to be….if anythin Ron says contradicts it, then its real simple…it isnt your God but a counterfeit. You would rightly assume that if a God is a REAL God he would be;
    Fair
    Non confusing
    Logical
    Could write in an easy to understand manner which is impossible to interpret any way other than one way and one way only
    Completely 100% accurate in all prophecies if any are given
    I’m sure you can think of more…everythin is simple when you start analysing things with common sense/logic and put the fear factor to the back of your mind and refuse to let IT be part of your decision and thus cloud your judgement using analytical/critical thinking

  • Aggie says:

    “Is there some link between COG-ism an UFO’s? “

    Weinland certainly thought so, in 2008.

  • Aggie says:

    “(Aggie will soon swoop in and insist that to be the only possibility)”

    Meh. I really don’t care anymore. I’m only here right now because I can’t sleep. And there’s this Bible verse that’s been bugging me, something about dogs and vomit…. (I mean me, obviously, for coming back here LOL.)