The First First Trumpet Two Years Later
False Prophet Ronald Weinland is closer to home this weekend, only two states up in the Detroit Michigan area. Greg is ungaoled and gave the opening prayer. Nevertheless, Ron still had not put up the sermon recording over three hours after the sermon was over even with a geek in attendance.
Sunday AM Update: The sermon recording is still not posted on the PKG website. As a public service, here is a recording of it — prepare to be bored. (25 MB MP3 download) The first couple of minutes of the recording are Ron continuing to battle the hookup (“Oh boy!!!”") before starting services.
Ron is continuing his long sermon series on the passover. An interesting aside was his criticism of small groups that formed out the breakup of WCG in 1995, and how a minister would go off on tangent. Of course Ron is not doing that because he is given new truths such as the origin of Christ by God and we know that absolutely for sure because Ron told us so.
Ron claimed a mighty escalation in the thunders during the last few months. Which thunders are those? The only one that he might hang his hat on is the second thunder, with a several major earthquakes that did not effect the modern day nations of Israel and the Icelandic volcano which has a peripheral impact on the tribes of Israel. The graphs on my last post do show an increase in earthquake thunders over the past few months, but not as Ron as prophesied with a 3-year delay for the current precedented magnitudes. Even if the earthquake thunder does get worse and worse as Ron claimed today, it’s still too late to prove him as a prophet because it didn’t happen when or how he said it was to happen. Besides which there are 6 other thunders to look at.
Today is also a prophetic date. It was two years ago today that Ron, Laura, and the Harrells were in Jerusalem for the event of the first non-blowing of the First Trumpet on April 17, 2008. There was quite a buzz on certain corners of the Internet leading up to that day, with his Google ad campaign in full swing serving up ad links to “the-end.com” for key words such as “armageddon”. And two years ago this Monday is the second anniversary of the first time that the Spokesman witness issued a death curse against me.
Tags: Thunders
This volcano situation is a danger because scum like weinland will jump all over it like a fly on sh** (no offence meant to the fly)…..but so will a hundred other false prophets out there be declaring it is proof of their divinely appointed position on earth. Unfortunately from all the hype in the media….this will push people even more towards people like rw. If it carries on gettin worse and the Katla volcano erupts right next to it….then i expect ron will unfortunately get a number of more followers…atleast in europe anyway….
First timeline, second timeline, second timeline edit… I gather Ron can keep the second timeline edit going for sometime into 2011 when the 5th trumpet fails to sound by his August (or some such) dead-line.
Yet people keep paying the man to come up with this stuff and spin yarns back at them, is it the entertainment factor? With over 6.8 billion people in the world Ron is such a bad actor that he can only garner 350 +/- souls into his fleecing? That’s some pretty bad salesmanship figuring that he started off with a proven winning pitch in WCG’s Herbert’s sales pitch that garnered such a large following.
I note other WCG splinters that have done so much better, flock wise. It’s like Ron is no good at his job yet can not make himself admit it to himself and come up with a different line of work.
A Witness of God, oh please… A delusional man of money and self glory on the other hand?
Go figure?
No way will I listen to a sermon of his. I have better things to do with my time.
It IS amazing how Ron doesn’t apply any of what he says to himself. I guess he’s exempt from his own accusations and observations. I wish that, whenever he makes a comment like he does: “An interesting aside was his criticism of small groups that formed out the breakup of WCG in 1995, and how a minister would go off on tangent.”, a mirror would pop up in front of his face and he would be looking at himself. That mirror would be popping up all the time.
Hmmm, that would make a good Twilight Zone episode.
“This volcano situation is a danger because scum like weinland will jump all over it like a fly on sh**…..”
Strong words Steve. Maybe a reason why helpingusoon (Dominic) made such a robust response ?
Thanks for posting the latest sermon Mike.
Yes, Steve did use strong words, perhaps stronger than I would have used. Steve has a bit of entitlement, as he was deceived by Ron.
When it comes to Ron, mocking is allowed on this blog. If it comes to more serious allegations, for example if someone accused him of sexual abuse or something of that nature, they’d have to present more evidence.
When it comes to saying something like that about another commenter on the blog, I may step in. I left Dominic’s comments up because they said more about him than us, and whatever we said about his spiritual idol did not justify his response.
You’re welcome for the sermon. I expect you’ll enjoy it more than I.
Steve,
With your permission, may I rephrase your comment? “The problem with situations like this volcano is that false prophets like Mr. Weinland will use it to their advantage to further deceive those who have left themselves vulnerable to deception by refusing to heed Deut. 18:20-22.”
I looked up the definition of “scum”:
1. A filmy layer of extraneous or impure matter that forms on or rises to the surface of a liquid or body of water.
2. The refuse or dross of molten metals.
3. Refuse or worthless matter.
4. Slang One, such as a person or an element of society, that is regarded as despicable or worthless.
If you were using #4 to describe Mr. Weinland’s actions as “despicable”, that part of your comment was relevant.
The rest of his comment, Mal, is acceptable by Mike’s rules; Dominic went way far and beyond that in his comments but I don’t hear you complaining about that. Since even he is not trying to excuse his behavior, maybe you shouldn’t either.
angel
I think you understand the thrust of my comment to Steve.
I have already thanked Dominic for apologising to the people on this blog.
Hang on a minute – if you look at the whole graph, you will see that spikes occur all the time. If you give yourself enough time (and it looks like 2-4 years does the trick) then you can catch the spike and claim it. For instance, I can say “within the next 5 years, god will send an increase in seismic activity to show you that I he agrees with me about the contents of your bank account needing desperate relocation to my offshore account, so kindly send me 10% of your income” and be reasonably certain that a spike will occur within that timeframe.
The problem is that it is psychologically very attractive to think of yourself as one of the chosen ones, as privy to gods special plan, and that is what this whole cult is based on. After that it does not really matter how unlikely the explanations are – they will be swallowed enthusiastically, because as you can see, there are a fair few people who want the world to end and live in a perfect world as a chosen person. Anything that looks even remotely like it will fit the prophesy will be magnified, anything that does not will be ignored. Rinse, spin, repeat.
This will trap even reasonably honest searchers for the “true end times” – they will have several things in the back of their minds before they even start, namely
1: The bible is literally true and things will happen as described in there
2: In it, clues can be found telling you when the end-times will happen
3: It would be especially nice if these times happened soon, because we feel the world is a mess.
And lo! most of the things they find correspond not just with 1 and 2, but also with 3. But the 3 suppositions have never been proved – they depend on a leap of faith. You cannot reach valid logical conclusions if you base them on illogical, faith based presuppositions. You can believe god made the world – but you cannot reach conclusions about, say, physics based on that belief. Faith does not tell you how it was done, or how the universe works. It is attractive to pretend it does, which is why it is hard to get people to see how futile it is and why so many cults have apocalyptic elements.
Mal said “Strong words Steve. Maybe a reason why helpingusoon (Dominic) made such a robust response ?”
Not strong words Mal…just words that even it mentions in your bible….it says sh** in many places except it uses the term used in those days which is “dung”….”it is just a word” and has been corrupted by legalist christians/traditions of men to mean something evil and hence why many think it is a bad word when in reality it is a “natural” word. I agree there are probably times when it may be innaprpriate to use such words in certain contexts, but not all and certainly not this case i represent as i was merely describing a “natural” act of a fly….if i had of used the word “poo” or “excrement” or “faeces”…it would still be the same…the only difference is that your “mind” has been used to thinking in the context of sh__ is bad, but it is ok to say anythin else which describes the same thing (i am puttin things into context mal…not assumin you fit the criteria to a “T”…im just usin this argument for context but if it applies in full 100% rooting, then there you have it) …i used to think exactly this way too about all kinds of things but after certain things happened and then the “final straw” with weinland…well i just can’t take anyones “word” for anythin but only hard facts and i believe i have represented a hard fact about how “sometimes” it is appropriate to use such words as the sh word….i only don’t spell it out because i respect mike’s rules and it is his right to decide what goes on in “his” forum/blog regardless of if i agree with it or not. Please don’t think i am insinuating i am better than you by sayin “i used to think in that way too” (above)…i know i am definately not better…just incase you misunderstand the context of what i am sayin….most likely you are far better person than me as is Angel to whom i will respond below….but before i do…;
God even calls/compares people to pieces of dung all through the bible…….yes i have proof such as 2nd book of kings chapter 9, verse 37….jeremiah 8: verses 1 and 2…job 20: 7, jeremiah 9: 22 …and i particularly like this one where God says he will spread sh/dung all over his enemies faces…phillipians chapter 3, verse 9.there are others too….but more in a “conversation” type manner
And Angel said: “With your permission, may I rephrase your comment? ”
“If” i have understood you right Angel (and i may be wrong so please let me know if thats the case)….but i think you are doing what mal said and objecting to my use of the “sh” word?….if so this is my response;
I don’t see the need to re-phrase it as explained above but i understand where you are comin from. Even from your perspective though, it is scripturally accurate to use such words in many curcumstances and not a problem even in Gods eyes as above also. Too many christians listen to what their preacher says is right and wrong instead of listening/readin what the bible actually says. I am not saying this is you Angel (as i “try” to not make assumptions)….but it definately is the case of most christians (from experience in the past)…i refuse to bow to societies traditions and i intend to research every last thing out instead of takin someone elses word for it that it is “wrong” or “right”….i have to be the one to decide that for myself.
And yes Angel, the 4th explanation of what scum is was my chosen interpretation of the word “scum” lol.
But to a message to both you Mal and Angel, i respect your minds and hearts for they are trying to do what is right and you are both clearly good hearted people (from what i can tell), so i have nothing against you if you think i do by my response…i am merely replying to your objection to what i said and trying to perhaps open your minds a little more….either way you are free to choose whatever way to live you wish and i have no probs with it
Man i think i have talked way too much in this post!
Steve,
I completely understand your use of the sh__ word, and I do feel your use of it fit the context of what you were communicating. I wasn’t so much trying to correct you for using it as demonstrating, for Mal’s benefit, that the meaning is clear no matter what words you use to say it. I’m glad you don’t assume I let preachers do my thinking for me instead of reading what the Bible says for myself; this is why you’ve never heard me mention what teachers I listen to (there are quite a few, actually). I don’t follow men, I follow Christ.
The point I’ve tried to make with Mal is that if you’re going to complain about mocking, you should be consistent; if it’s not okay for one person, then it’s not okay for anyone. Neither he nor I make the rules on this blog, and I think the point has been made that he doesn’t like the fact that Mike allows mocking of Ron.
Mal,
I realize you’ve already acknowledged Dominic’s apology, but it seems you’re still trying to justify his behavior. He’s not trying to, so why are you?
Thanks for clarifying Angel…i am also very glad to know you study things for yourself…always good to hear
Are we seriously arguing about the “S” word when I worked so hard in the ’70′s and ’80′s to make the “F” word more mainstream?
Ron is not even an interesting nutcase. He’s boring and predictable. I’m going to go back to monitoring David J. Smith. At least he talks about The Illuminati, and the One World Order, and really cool nutty stuff! What’ Ron got? Nada!
Mal, the subject of rabid mocking came up on the other thread. I asked you define exactly what you mean by “rabid”, but you never did. I’d like to have you do that.
I’d also like you to explain your viewpoint of Weinland’s death curses. Do you find it acceptable for Weinland to have done that? It seems to me that you and some other Weinland followers have different standards for acceptable behavior along these lines, and if I’ve misunderstood, please explain.
“I note other WCG splinters that have done so much better, flock wise. “
Not according to what’s going down with the Council of Evil (United Church of God), at least….
In that case, they’re actively trying to sabotage Kilough’s power-hungry grab for the masses, which looks like it might have been frighteningly effective, if it had been implemented….Instead, Kilough was shown the the door. Why? Because the Council of Evil wants to replicate the “glory” of “the telecast” on “broadcast television”. Too, the same very vocal, very highly-placed 500 ordained souls of the hierarchy of the dis-United Church of God: Amongst all the sturm und drang on the Internet, very few, if any, actual, tithes-paying members in good standing of the UCG has commented on this whole mess, it has either been council members, elders, deacons, or their wives, respectively.
Most of the screaming and hollering seems to be happening because Kilough and his buddies put the kibosh on recreating Big Sandy, which is what the dissident faction of UCG’s “god’s government on earth” really wants, much as the members (or the ordainees themselves) might deny this, and say it is “all about money” (i.e., too expensive to have Headquarters based in Cincy.) Apparently, Wyoming and New Hampshire were proposed as alternate Headquarters locations, because both states were just as cheap as, if not cheaper than, Texas. Those suggestions were, predictably, completely ignored, as was (fortunately for all of us) Kilough’s power-mad plan for world domination, which sounded like it would have been frighteningly effective, if it had been implemented.
Fortunately, the dyed-in-the-wool Armstrongists on the Council of Evil are so set into “the One True Work” mindset, that they won’t entertain any ideas that aren’t exact model replicas of the administration and governance of “god’s true church”….well, other than the fact that they believe there’s strength in numbers, and they can rule with a mightier iron fist, if there are more of them to crack down on any dissent; which does seem to have been proven true, WRT the Failbook disfellowshipments/warnings/dismissals/bannings. (They apparently got Abigail Cartwright’s Failbook account suspended — how’s THAT for a “hands-off” church, eh??)
So yeah, we’ve (ex-member bloggers) been a little preoccupied, otherwise; what’s Witless Weinland and the Merry Missus up to, again?
There are some words that are always going to offend somebody.
For example, before I was a Christian it bothered me whenever I heard the name “Jesus”; literally I could feel the hair on the back of my neck stand up and it would irritate me – if it was on the radio or TV, I’d quickly change the channel, if it was a person I would try to end the conversation as soon as possible – politely if they’d let me, but if they tried to drag it out I could get rude.
My language could get salty back in the day, and I always knew who I could use it around and who would be offended; knowing that, it then became my decision whether I cared about that or not.
In this environment, where we have believers/unbelievers alike, it makes sense to expect that not everyone is concerned about such things. Thankfully most here are pretty moderate; I’ve seen some websites where every other word is the “f” word – that gets old quickly and makes me wish they’d remember there are other descriptive words in the English language. It becomes something that seems to be done for shock value – different strokes for different folks, I guess.
(Click “See More” under Erik Jones’ post, to read the entirety of Kilough’s war strategy; talk about the Power of the Beast!)
Aggie, your knowledge of the Armstrongite splinters is indeed wide spread and informative. The UCG is a whole-nother BOOK on crazy armstrongite splinter cells gone mad. The note that about PKG is that makes me truely glad is that it is so terribly small, unlike the it’s larger breathren splinters. This is a good thing and makes me think “Weinland is a poor salesman of his wares, the other salesman from the same cloth have done so much better using the same material and same approach”. Why? I would rather think the others keep there desires of God-Hood kept better in check than Ron of the many titles and huge ego. That’s not to state that the others are not egotistical as well just that ol-Ron seems to be at the top of the delusional game. I mean honestly, coming right out and issueing death curses against other splinter ministers is way over the top.
Ron is a poor salesman and his ultra-small following tells the tale. His delusion gets in the way of a rather good Con and his con-game gets in the way of a rather wild delusion. He’s not concentrating on one or the other just doing what he feels like at the time. This is the recipe for a luke warm dinner, or luke warm following, as is shown in Rons numbers.
Thank goodness, just think if Ron could speak? He could be even bringing into his church the level headed as well as, as Herby did, some of the more brighter bulbs of society to work for him and his church.
But he can’t and therefor does not. So who is Ron left with, the left overs, the delusional, those without talent and wanting so badly to be led by the nose.
A poor show for ol-Ron. He has great opportunity and such little talent to pull it off.
The twit has even put a end cap on his ministry, mid to late 2011 when the many trumpets must sound or there can not be enough time to bring togethor the armies, for the Pope to turn into a Demon Ruler, for the Bible to even be correct about it’s own time tables… You see, if Ron where a good Con-Man he would not have painted himself into this corner, but he did. What a twit!
Go figure?
Mike
“I asked you define exactly what you meant by “rabid”
I used the word ‘rabid’ in the context of ‘extreme’.
………………………………………………………………………………………
“I’d also like you to explain your viewpoint of Weinland’s death curses. Do you find it acceptable for Weinland to have done that?”
I can only quote Scripture and how I see it. Curses are imposed when we sin in accordance to Deuteronomy 28. Some of these curses are to death:-
(Deu 28:15) And it shall be, if you will not listen to the voice of Jehovah your God, to observe and to do all His commandments and His statutes which I command you today, all these curses shall come on you and overtake you.
(Deu 28:20) Jehovah shall send on you cursing, vexation, and rebuke, in all that you set your hand to do, until you are destroyed, and until you perish quickly, because of the wickedness of your doings by which you have forsaken Me.
(Deu 28:21) Jehovah shall make the plague cling to you until He has consumed you from off the land where you go to possess it.
(Deu 28:22) Jehovah shall strike you with lung disease and with a fever, and with an inflammation, and with an extreme burning, and with the sword, and with blasting, and with mildew. And they shall pursue you until you perish.
I would consider that IF (note the IF) Ronald Weinland was God’s true spokesman, then he would have the right to convey to a sinner the judgement that God had decreed.
I find it so interesting that Ron’s first exercise of his witness powers was to curse his mockers.
Why not exercise his powers to increase the thunders? Petition God that he reveal himself more fully? Stop the rain? Cause more earthquakes?
I just think the MINDSET behind putting a death curse on his mockers FIRST AND FOREMOST says that the man is angry about being ‘teased’ all the time. He must have thought FINALLY he could be proven right if all his mockers suffered a death due to his first exercise of powers. Who would DARE tease the man again??
Then Ron would have been RIGHT. Oh the pride.
Ron HATES his mockers – he can’t seem to resist to read what we say about him. He preaches that we are blind and not called, in the next breath he puts a death curse on us because we are not called (I don’t see even the logic).
Again, I would understand him putting a death curse on mockers who BELIEVED HE WAS GOD’S FINAL WITNESS, as they would be knowingly mocking God’s message – but none of us believe Ron is who he says he is, so why is he putting a death curse on any of us? We are just poor blind people who haven’t been called yet are we not??
I just believe that a REAL witness of God would be too busy going about his work to worry about what his mockers are saying about him. What would the REAL witness of God be so afraid of?
Wouldn’t the REAL witness be battling against the people who actually DID believe he was God’s Final Witness, and wanted to kill him for it? (ie. supposedly the Pope)??
“Oh Laura, they are at it again!!!! Mike and Dill are being so mean to me, and now more so to you too. I wish our witness powers would be so much more powerful to enable us to deal with these sickos, sick, sick, sick!!! I’m dumbfounded at their hatred towards me, twisting everything I say”.
“Don’t worry dear, I am getting much better at creating Tsunamis in the bathtub, and have been practising my glare in the mirror, and at check out operators – I swear some of them look terrified. I can feel our power growing day by day”.
“We must practice our skills yet even more dear. In the meantime, the mockers will pay a heavy price for the mocking of God, a very high price indeed. Did I tell you that God has given me another title for a third book? 2012 – The Mayans were Right” (and so was Steven Speilberg).
As for me, I see a good cartoon series when all of this is over……
Mal, I agree “extreme” is sort of what “rabid” means. But “rabid” also connotes something that brings to mind “Old Yeller”, a rabid animal mindlessly attacking anything that moves. Wicktionary has “rabid” as meaning “very extreme, unreasonable, or fanatical in opinion; excessively zealous”. I would have you know that the mocking here is reasoned and limited. We don’t make up things of which to accuse him. It does not rise to the level of “extreme”, much less “very extreme”.
Let me put it another way. Is there any level of mocking of Weinland that you would NOT consider to be rabid?
In all those verses in Deut. you quoted, there wasn’t even a hint that God would delegate the curses to someone else. Nor that these curses would be imposed on someone for making fun of someone else, for not being able to look past all the failed prophecies to recognize Ron as being a true prophet of God after all.
Would you also agree that if Weinland is a false prophet, then I an justified in mocking him? After all, fair is fair, right?
Using Mal’s logic, curses should come upon anyone who does not obey Deut. 18:20-22. Mal, if you’re not afraid of being cursed for not obeying that passage, then you should understand why we don’t fear being cursed for mocking/disbelieving a false prophet.
Kirrily, you are so funny! I completely agree that it seems his hissy fits are about hating to be teased! I have wondered myself why someone who supposedly believes so completely that he is God’s witness, with supernatural power to destroy his enemies, would be so constantly in a frazzle about being mocked – unless – the mocking hits a nerve because it’s a constant reminder of his failure to prophesy accurately, and a threat to his ability to continue to keep his followers on the hook.
If God was truly so prideful/egotistical (like Ron) and so quick to curse everyone all the time like Ron does….there would probably be none of us left lol….earth population= “2″ (ron and his wife-maybe his followers if “they are completely zombificated loyal and obedient”). Hence Ron is full of hot air
I am going to risk sounding preachy here, but if it is OK for God (through Ron) to curse someone to death for mocking a prophet whose accuracy is so abysmal and whose credentials are so underwhelming that next to no-one even notices him, doesn’t it bother all you Christians here that you are actually nicer people than your own god? Credo in dio crudel indeed…
All Mike has done is to keep Ron to basic standards of credibility. Ron is unable to meet those standards as all his prophesies fail one by one, timelines need to be shifted around, and some serious theological footwork is required just to keep the story together. All you need to do to show this is to take his prophesies, and keep track of how he changes them as they fail to come to fruition. That is all mike does. That he also pokes fun of them once in a while is only to be expected, as it gets sillier and sillier as the squirming and backtracking intensifies.
None of you would condemn a man to death for this, I am sure. I don’t think a single one of you is enough of an extremist to condemn a man to death for having an honest, carefully reasoned opinion.
Are you saying that it is OK for god to curse someone simply for pointing out the blatantly obvious? If god sends us a bungling idiot for a prophet, can he really expect us not to laugh? And this IS what is happening – this prophet published a book predicting explicitly that the united states would be overrun by now.
I would say that if Ron is indeed a prophet, there is no hope for any of us, because that would mean god is a cruel tyrant who likes to play mindgames with us and sets us up to fail.
“I would say that if Ron is indeed a prophet, there is no hope for any of us, because that would mean god is a cruel tyrant who likes to play mindgames with us and sets us up to fail.”
Exactly! Reason 45,827 that Ron is obviously a despising little man lost in his own mind: Rons made up God would kill everyone but 350 people in the world and call is just? Who would like to come back and follow this God? Anyone? A murderer on a scale that makes the like of Nazi Germanies programs in the 1940′s a mere childs experiment. Ya, who wants to love and embrace this Tyrant God?
Go figure?
Matt,
I understand the point you’re trying to make, but there are a couple of things to consider when comparing the situations you mentioned; first off, the Israelites had a covenant with God in which they had agreed to obey His commandments or suffer the consequences. God had just performed some amazing miracles to get them out of Egypt, so they had no legitimate reason to doubt or disobey Him.
As Christians, we are not in that covenant, nor do we have the advantage of having seen God do those types of miracles.
God had pronounced a judgment on prophets whose prophecies failed to come to pass, so His curses were not applicable to those instances.
Sadly, people who insist on following a false prophet make God look like a capricious, mind game playing tyrant. This is one of the reasons God has pronounced a death sentence on false prophets, I believe.
Hi Angel
You prove my point exactly – If Ron is right, then most Christians are more thoughtful and nicer than (his version of) God himself.
Most Christians are indeed more righteous and worthy of praise than the God of Abraham as he is presented in the Bible. Thanks to Exodus 21:7 I finally “woke up” and got free. Ron Weinland is a FALSE prophet and I encourage all Christians (and everyone else) to stand up to this monster. There is no reason why we can’t agree theologically on at least this issue.
You will find us atheists (or at least me) make great allies when it comes to outing a religious fraud!